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Oliver J. Lodge
Oliver Joseph Lodge (1851 – 1940, famous English Physician, Wikipedia
etc.) published a large number of scientific essays and books. He
occupied prominent positions; amongst others he was an eminent pioneer
in the field of broadcast/radio.
Oliver Lodge was deeply engaged with the topic “Life After Death”. In
this connection he composed besides books regarding other fields of
topics his well known book “Raymond”. He dedicated this book to his son
who was killed in action 1915 during world war two and with whom he had
many dialogues via various mediums. Our conversation with Raymond you
will find separately under the topic “Raymond Lodge”, the talks with
Oliver about the Scole Experiments will be published under a special
topic “Scole”. In the following
chapter we will report about the conversations with Oliver Lodge, whom
we already know since 1995 from séances in
Subject of Conversations
1. Ether and Cosmos
2. Ectoplasm and other Physical Phenomena
3. Various questions addressed to Oliver during a Group Sitting
4. Extracts from conversations with Claudius and spirit friends about
Oliver Lodge
1. Ether and Cosmos
Cl: Here is – and
he is more often with me – and since you have lately often talked about
him – Oliver J. Lodge
-. W: Yes, Joseph. Cl: We will see
if he can talk to you. He endeavours to talk through Karin, the last
time he talked through a male medium, through Raymond Smith (Engl.
Trance Medium whom O.L. gave daily messages over a long period of time
with the result that three books were published). But Oliver tries
to talk through Karin in similar way, because the structure is very
similar, the kind of mediumship, he says. Should you have questions
about it, you might ask him personally. So I shall lean back now and
watch how you get along. W: Can we just
arrange in which language we talk? Cl: You will see.
I hand you over now to Sir Oliver J. Lodge.
E: Well, what a surprise - one has to swallow first – hello! OL: Hello
friends, please do me one favour. Let me just start introducing myself
in English and when I got used to the voice of the medium we then shall
switch over to your language which, of course, is easier for you and I
probably then can adapt. E: Thank you. W: You are very much welcome in our
round. OL: I am Oliver
Lodge. I am so 'proud', I must say - I don’t really like the word
'proud' - but still I am a bit 'proud', I must say - you can put that in
brackets - that you are so interested in my work. Raymond’s
(Raymond Smith, Engl. medium) and Karin’s structures, as Claudius
already said, are similar. They have the same way to translate thoughts
from our world to your world. It is a certain kind of mediumship, if you
would like to put it that way that is to bring it over more in the
philosophical way. Good. So now
let’s try to switch over to the German language. Perhaps you start in
saying something in German. (Note: In the
original script the part beginning here is all in German)
W: Well, then I will carry on talking in German. I am incredibly happy,
and I think here I also talk in your behalf, Ernst ...
E: Of course.
W: … that we are very privileged to have you here tonight as our guest.
It is a great honour for us. We read many of your writings. Also the
messages you channelled through Raymond Smith have impressed us very
much, because it is similar to the style Claudius conveys to us.
OL: Yes, this is just what I wanted to tell you. This kind of mediumship
is similar to what you are doing here. You are more working in a
dialogue form, whereas with Raymond Smith it is more the monologue
including other spirit entities as well.
But principally it is in its manner comparable to your style in
communication, and therefore it is quite easy for me to talk to you.
W: With the German language you don’t have any problems, compliment. First of all a
personal question: I have the feeling that in Scole we perhaps already
have talked to each other, is that right? OL: Yes. E: This is new to
me. OL: Yes, in Scole
we revealed our real names somehow in a hidden way, open for
speculation.
W: For various reasons, I can understand that.
OL: But it was probably obvious, since I used my second name (Joseph).
W: Thank you very much for the confirmation. I
would like to come back to the three books in which you gave messages
through Raymond Smith. We like them very much, and I am always again
surprised how these messages are in line with those of Claudius, how
strong the conformity is. OL: Yes, because
we on our level have an interaction. If at your side questions arise
then we bring them up for discussion over here as well. We are not
all-knowing too and often have the desire to figure out things and find
out what is behind it. We are not always successful, because still on
our level there are mysteries, but we have a certain imagination about
what will follow. Also we cannot
perceive the conception behind creation, but we do not question it. We
perceive that creation contains a cosmic law and that the universe is -
how shall I say - ... W: … built up? OL: ... built up,
and that you can comprehend this built up of the universe with the help
of mathematics, but at a certain point you have of course limits as
well. The universe can be conceived mathematically, because also there
is one and one two, but you still cannot look behind the creation,
something the natural scientist would like to be able to. And this is
neither possible for us, and if you ask me what was before the so called
- I purposely say so-called “Big Bang”, then I cannot give you a good
answer. And this nobody is able to do in our spheres.
E: In this respect I have the following question. We are principally all
spirits and we humans are quite a bit constricted and restricted and we
cannot perceive all that you can as bodiless entities.
Does the cosmos exist for you as observable something or do you have to
step into some other spheres to at all recognise the cosmos, for we are
told that you do not have a material surrounding, and we are as
scientists over here of the opinion that the cosmos is a material
structure?
OL: The question is discussed at your side – it is asked by Wheeler:
Does the cosmos exist at all if you do not investigate it, if you do not
observe it? E: Right, yes.
OL: And it is similar over here at our side. If we engage ourselves in
these matters, we have to dive into an artificial world, an artificially
created world, in a world that normally does not exist for us.
E: Exactly. OL: So that, if
we are not interested in these questions, for us this cosmos does not
exist for us as you perceive it from the physical standpoint. It is a
kind of special form of our imagination. And therefore it
is difficult to give you a more plausible answer, because even for the
mystic as well as for the natural scientist the cosmos exists, if it is
observed, objectively in the same form.
Thus from our side this applies as well, if we focus on the cosmos and
comprehend what you on earth do or question, then we do not get a
different answer as you do.
So that the mental activity on our side in comparison to your activity
in this regards on earth is not too much different.
E: Well, then there occurs a problem. We are quite convinced that our
scientists receive a certain spiritual leading or impulses from your
side, ...
OL: Yes.
E: … that activates the development, and these then would have to be on
the basis of your own imagination – and as you described it – that there
is a certain plan to transfer these impulses to our scientists, or is it
an automatic process included in cosmic affairs? OL: It is
actually an automatism within the cosmic plan. But we as scientists came
from the earthly to the spirit environment with our earthly concept. If
we in lifetime were already very open for different areas, let’s say the
more spiritual areas, then we can from our view now evaluate
differently. Then we are more open here and can pass respective impulses
onto you. Scientist who still insist on their rigid earthly arguments
will still give impulses from here to you on earth in the same way.
So that the number of those - if you consider the spiritual advancement
in the nature science - that effectuate the spiritual development in the
natural science on your side via impulses is not too high.
E: This is plausible, don’t you think so, Walter!? W: Yes. Obviously
it seems that these impulses reach some of our scientific individuals
more than others. OL: Certainly,
this has something to do with the cognitive structure. E: Yes, we won’t
get along without the structure. OL: Yes.
W: I would like to come back to the consciousness of the cosmos at your
side. If we talk about cosmos then automatically time is involved. OL: Yes.
W: That means we can follow a development, we see how stars are born,
die, how the cosmos, the universe changes. How can I get a clue about a
cosmos without time? OL: Assume that the ordinary human
comes into spirit world, that he will not be interested anymore at all in
cosmic matters. But spirits like me or my colleagues, we are still
interested in these topics and of course follow with interest the news
what happens on earth in this regard. Since the cosmos is only in our earthly
memory present, we still get kind of trapped by time, imagining that
there is a sequence of time involved. We know better, but still this is
not yet totally out of our mind. It is not that after the transition the
time feeling is totally eliminated within a moment. You take the memory
of it with you. And now we try to get rid of our old habits concerning
cosmos and universe. But, believe me, it is not that easy. You live if you concentrate on these
things in a different world. I can dive into your world... W: Yes. OL: ... and realize again that for you
time has a great importance. I am of course aware of that and I am at
the same time aware of the cosmic timelessness. But to totally imagine a cosmos - where
everything is existing at the same time - this is still for us not
possible to capture, this I must honestly admit. W: Yes. I am glad about your honesty.
We would anyhow have problems if you would say that you have a feeling
for it. This again would initiate many questions by us. OL: It is kind of insight and, of
course, I have the knowledge of a timeless cosmos, but my consciousness
is not yet able to fully activate this cognition. W: Yes, I
understand what you mean. OL: And this is
partly on hand like a flash. W: Now
independent from the timelessness. If you are now - in comparison to
earthly times – occupied with the cosmos, especially with the ether that
was introduced by you quite strongly, ... OL: Yes, my
favourite topic.
W: … have you now - since you are over there now – revealed new insights
in this respect? OL: This ether
theory, stressed by me, of course is not to understood by many people,
but here there is in regard to the conventional opinion a not to big
difference. For me ether
means the cosmic substance that keeps everything alive - to explain it
an easy way to understand -. It is not measurable, of course, and at the
same time it is no – I would like to point out – natural scientific
theory. It was meant by me actually always as a spiritual substance that
cannot be measured or captured in a scientific way.
E: Now I have a question about the wording. The word substance means for
us something material, but I think it should be seen more as a carrier
system. OL: Exactly, this
is a good term. It is difficult
to convey it. In the past - and still now – I was asked why as a
scientist I do not channel scientific discourses to you. This is a basic
problem. We depend on that what we can convey through the medium that
means if we would have a scientist as medium a scientific conversation
would definitely be easier in regard to scientific data and terminology. Since we have to
cope with the mental structure, the education of the medium it is not
possible to talk in scientific terms more intensively.
E: Yes, it would be a dream if one day spirits were able to activate a
computer. OL: This might be
possible in future, although a connecting human person on your side is
still necessary as link. To work with technical devices alone, this I
cannot imagine at the moment. There must be a personal connection in the
first place to a human being who is operating the device. E: Yes, this is
interesting; you probably have heard that we earlier talked to Claudius
about computer influences that have taken place in this house. Claudius
said that they have tried to make an attempt via computer. Since only
Karin was at home and could have sat in front of the computer during
this computer contact, she probably then also functioned as medium in
this case. (The attempt by
our friends was an e-mail-contact by a spirit person named “Paul”) OL: Yes,
certainly. This also would have happened if she would not have been
within the room, respectively it presumably did happen when she did not
sit in front of the computer. Her former presence as information of her
personality alone was sufficient.
E: Yes, that is interesting. Last time I asked if it would not be
possible that more advanced spirits could manifest through the structure
of the device without human medium on our side.
OL: This was your conversation with Claudius who - as far as I know –
who explained that spirit takes every possible opportunity to manifest,
do you mean that conversation? E: Yes, yes.
OL: But this certainly is a very, very, very advanced form where spirit
does not represent a spirit entity out of our world, but spirit neutral
as spirit information.
E: Not material but spiritual.
OL: Yes, in a spirit sense, that means therefore if a technical device -
so called intelligent devices – once will be constructed and spirit will
manifest in it then it will not be in that way that a spirit person,
coming from our world, will do that, ... E: Aha.
OL: … what you have at the moment (EVP).
E: Yes.
OL: If your computer, if your tape recorder is manipulated then it is so
that this comes from our spirit world. Concerning these future devices
that might come into use, this then would be a different form of
manipulation. E: Yes. W: It is
interesting that we just a while ago have heard your voice that has
manifested independent in the room at Leslie Flint’s home. OL: Yes, I have
worked with very good mediums. But as I said before, they are more on
the philosophical side and it was not possible to bring through
scientific contents. And this you will have noticed during your previous
work within the Scole group. Also there we
have had the chance to talk through two excellent mediums and only were
able to give instructions and vaguely explanations, because even for a
scientist over here it is sometimes very difficult to explain
experiments that are even for us here are partially not repeatable. W: This
repeatability is a characteristic of the scientist here that when
something is repeatable it reaches credibility. OL: This does not
apply to us as experimenter; we are convinced by the phenomena, but not
all scientists over here. There are quite a number who reject it. But if we engage
ourselves to be in contact with the physical world, we know what
principally happens during the experiments, but we unfortunately cannot
repeat it always in the same manner, since we depend on the all over
constellation in that moment.
W: Are our physics - as we see it in our earthly environment - a special
form of a superordinate physics as it is seen at your side?
OL: Yes, you could say so. If you will, everything is in order. The
universe, the cosmos is built upon a numerically foundation and is to be
calculated virtually to a certain point. It is a simple language, and
your earthly physics is an adjusted special form.
W: Targeted to describe material things. OL: Yes, that’s
right, you do not have a different possibility. And the cosmos is not to
be conceived other than with mathematics, with physical laws by you. W: Have you got
in your world regularities, a cosmic law? OL: You mean to
conceive the cosmos? W: Laws similar
to the physical laws? I don’t know if my question is asked adequately. OL: I told you at
the beginning that if we dive into these areas we were interested
already during lifetime, especially the physics, where we were very
limited in comparison to the knowledge nowadays, so we have of course
advanced over here as well and research and develop together with you,
because otherwise we have no possibility available. The way is to
transfer earthly physical laws into the spirit spheres, a different
possibility, I at the moment do not see. W: For us higher
dimensions that go beyond that what we can conceive with our senses are
for us mostly only mathematical constructions. OL: That’s it. E: You say that a
numerical principle is the basis of the cosmos. OL: Yes. E: Or the other
way round that we as humans, as scientists have only access by
describing these coherences or laws by these numbers. OL: Exactly. W: The mathematics in principle. E: The mathematics of course and it is
always said that mathematics actually is a humane discipline. Und thus,
Walter, your question about the mathematics as humane discipline,
numerical principles, imaginary numbers – as we call it – which do not
have for us a real, tangible basis, but still are suitable to describe
the cosmos. Regrettably during our whole education at the universities
the background of the spiritual part in this context is no topic.
OL: That’s right.
It is all based on numbers, and it is principally a uniform language,
the cosmic language concerning the mathematical setup. But actually the
source of all is spirit. E: This cosmic mathematics might be
quite sophisticated, but we on earth approach it with quite a primitive
assumption and fail eventually upon the contradictions or the
complexity. OL: Yes, it is
not necessarily intended that the earthly scientist will get beyond this
point, because otherwise the whole earthly framework, law could get into
confusion that means as long as the earthly scientist is left standing
in a kind of darkness, he will be down to earth. So that from my
view I can’t see a great change in this respect that your research will
reach far beyond the current status in the future. I think, this also is
subject to a certain cosmic law. This is my personal opinion; perhaps
you receive a different answer from different communicator. E: Yes, I
understand that. Years ago during a sitting Nicola Tesla expressed a
similar opinion, because he also was with his perception ahead of time
and he failed. OL: Yes. E: Since we humans are absolute hungry
for energy there are predictions by scientists that we will not be able
for much longer to operate with our energy sources as we do. And searching for new energy sources
there are talks in this connection about a so called Free Energy or
Vacuum Energy of which - so we are told - plenty is available, but
obviously a possibility is not yet being found to utilise it.
OL: Yes, I know
the problem. I even believe it is the greater problem, the energy, since
humans in the meantime have exuberantly expanded it. Now they do not
want to give up their standard, the only possibility would be
conservation. But I think, if a
positive motive would stand behind it, it would be possible to extend
your research and to find a solution. It is not in the plan for the
human being to step back in past times. But they will in future develop
as they did before, perhaps with a bit more consciousness. And if they
use this consciousness reasonably, there will certainly be a solution. I
am in this direction quite positive. E: Yes, this is
of course a problem. OL: It’s not
going backwards. W: We would have
to find regenerative energy which does not change the condition of our
environment. OL: Yes, this is the thought behind,
because going backwards is not in the human plan of existence. He goes
forward and not backwards, W: I think so too, unless a great
catastrophe would arise which would initiate this. The goal should be to
find energy, energy sources that overcome the constraint. OL: But for sure the consciousness of
humans would have to change … E: Yes, that’s the point OL: Because what
is the use if you have the wonderful mountain slopes in the E: It is said: Humans are intelligent
beings. If we observe the human behaviour throughout the history then we
have to have great doubts if it is intelligent to act with no view into
the future about the consequences of our doing. And therefore I would
say, humans are not intelligent, because no intelligent being would saw
off the branch he sits on. OL: You are quite
right. Intelligence should be defined differently. Intelligence has
nothing to do that perhaps somebody is a luminary expert in mathematics
for example. Intelligence has something to do with the safeguarding of
survival. You can compare
humans with a cancer cell which also does not show intelligent
behaviour. It destroys its host and dies eventually as well. This is the
human behaviour and this has nothing to do with intelligence. Humans have in comparison to animals
the advantage of a full consciousness, but there are animals that are
much more intelligent than humans out of the view we just discussed. W: This is the basic pattern of taking
advantage. I see relatively small chances that there will be a change,
unless an emergency situation occurs. It seems to be a law of nature,
not a nice one, in ancient times perhaps for self-preservation, but
nowadays excessive. OL: I’m also not happy how life on
earth is being arranged, but we have to cope with it and have to be
humble about the fact that there really might be a sense behind it. But
I neither have the total overlook about the superior knowledge. W: We have some knowledge and learn out
of the happenings in the past and out of the respective consequences,
but it does not help the earth, if it at some point of time does not
catch up. OL: Yes, it is
still open how life on earth will continue and what will happen to
mankind. I have still hope that somehow some day there will be a change
in the human consciousness, be it by a painful learning process, so that
mankind might start to reflect. And this will most probably be a
starting point for a change in thinking. E: Well, once
there came through in a spirit message in “People learn
only - if at all – because of negative experiences and even then some do
not learn at all.” OL: Yes, like the cancer cell, it is
not learning that its host’s body is going weaker and weaker and that at
the end they die together. This is human behaviour as well. The
difference is that the cancer cell is governed by an automatism. It
cannot learn like humans can do, because it has no consciousness. E: Exactly. OL: So that the human consciousness
would be able to eventually effectuate something. E: It is at the moment just
underdeveloped. OL: Yes. The worst is the dreadful
greed. An animal that had enough food for the moment leaves the rest to
its herd or pride so that they do not have to starve, but humans do not
indentify themselves with the act of sharing, even if they have more
than enough for the rest of their lives. W: Is this way to think or act
continuing in your world? O: Yes, since the consciousness will
not change just because of the transition. This will continue until
spirits are willing and ready to see reason. If not it sometimes comes
to a, how shall I say ... W: Stagnation? OL: Yes, Stagnation. W: Now you could
come to the conclusion that if in the spirit world everything proceeds
in a more senseful way than on earth you would have the possibility to
help us in changing our behaviour and actions on earth. Since it is not
the case, I assume that it is meant this way, so that we can collect our
own experiences. OL: It is a very
difficult task. If a human incarnates he takes certain abilities into
his life, principally to adapt to earthly conditions, that means he
automatically accepts the conditions and adjusts to them. Even if he has got good intentions - to
just describe it in easy words - to reach his goal, it might be that the
environment, the conditions in this life that make this intentions
impossible. It is not easy in this world of greed
for an incarnated spirit to come to his set goal. There are too many
temptations on his way that make him stumble which in former times did
not happen in this extent. W: Was the temptation not that big? OL: The temptation was lesser, and it
was above all more stability to hand. If you incarnated in a poor family
you were aware of the fact that you would live in poverty. Nowadays you
might, as you yourself always say, get from rags to riches. And this is so difficult to fulfil your
task, you have set for yourself, because it can end totally differently,
and at the end you are disappointed not to have reached your set goal.
It is the temptations that rule the world at the moment. W: I can accept that. E: Do humans in a way loose the ground
under their feet caused by the speed-up, the increasing fast changes? OL: Certainly.
Drawing close to the end of the last century there were still some
values, for example the value of the family. People got married and it
was normal to get children, which seems nowadays is not like that
anymore. Even women don’t want to get married and many do not want to
have children anymore. Especially in
your country this is the case. Of course it seems to be more flexible,
since it is easier to get apart; everything is not as rigid as it was
before. That is true. What is the use
of it however if rigidness is eliminated and the human co-existence does
not function anymore, because nobody wants to take over any
responsibility for something anymore, even not for their own children
that result out of a relationship, but these children need guidance by
both, father and mother. Today there are
quite a number of single parents, and there is no social cohesion
anymore. Everybody needs a place to relax, and this is possible only in
the family. Everything is
more flexible and not so much more subject to dogmas, but the whole
framework breaks off, because nobody is willing anymore to take
responsibility for others, especially in respect to the children, so
that this cannot function properly long term. I think that these current
situations will change into a different direction again. But as you said,
in some way heaven has come closer to earth, but it is not possible to
utilize it at your side, to channel it correctly. In spirit spheres
there are no family ties, but rather the family are spirits within a
group, and it is no problem for the others if one of the spirits leaves
the family to change into a different group, but on earth these things
create pain, scars, since humans not yet are ready to understand that it
is possible to live flexible in a collective, but that they then would
have to give up their selfishness. It would be to
choose a form where the flexibility is not lost, but father, mother and
children still build an unity, perhaps in a kind of commune, a living
community where people in a greater number get together and stand up one
another and take over all duties together, also perhaps in unselfishness
and humanity for others. Only this would be the way to create on earth a better more flexible life, similar to the situation we have it here in the spirit spheres. But greed, material advantages and indifference W: Yes, I can accept that. It is
extremely difficult with the possibilities on earth to disengage
ourselves from that we call status symbols, ... OL: Certainly. W: ... in employment, in the family,
the neighbourhood, everywhere. It is difficult to leave all that behind
and start to live on different principles. OL: It is
difficult. Let’s say you share with someone who is poor. If this person
is in a good position because of your sharing act and he has got
therefore advantages, he might probably does not want to share with you
anymore if the situation changes, in case you need help. These are things
that do not work that way, unless you are a totally altruistically
person to give away all you have got and at the end you do not mind to
stand on the street with nothing anymore. W: As it looks
like earth is designed to the principle of “Not to give up”, dominance,
and this behaviour seems to me is almost planned or directed like that. OL: It is not
planned. It automatically resulted, developed, and if it was sensible to
leave humans their free will, this is a topic which still sometimes
keeps us busy thinking about. W: I would any
time change over to a harmonious surrounding, but in this situation here
on earth it is difficult. OL: Certainly.
Even if you and many others would like to, it will not be possible. It
is the same if you want to introduce socialism, it does not function,
and it will never function on earth. W:
On earth we can pretend to be a
“Saint” and in truth we have totally different intents. And I am in good
hope that this changes after the transition into your world - that this
false behaviour is not possible anymore. A good indication for this is
the openness of thoughts. E: Yes. OL: Yes. W: And to that
I’m looking forward. E: Well, if the
telepathy would increase here on earth it would perhaps be similar. OL: We do not
have a total oversight how earth will develop. I only can say and assure
you that it is not too important. It is only important for the
individual persons how they utilize their “intelligence”, the motives,
how they expand their consciousness. That is the most important task. The all over situation on earth is not
predictable, not even for us. Of course there are probabilities, but it
might come up totally different as well. E: Yes, it is not our intent to get
prophesies into the future. This we know from our last sitting with
Claudius when Walter asked about the most probable probability. It seems
to be incalculable and unclear, so to say a complex system, with many
influences and many components. OL: Right. If you ask me about the
future then it is a look into various possibilities, probabilities, so
that I cannot pick out one; I could describe them all to you. E Yes. OL: I can not pick out one and claim
that this is the right one. W: This reminds me a bit of chaotic
conditions where a small happening eventually has great effects.
OL: Yes, right, like a butterfly’s
strike of wing. W: What is the most important
enlightment for you in your past life with all the books you have
published, the research work etc. seen out of our present point of view.
What would you like to pass on to humans on earth in this respect? OL: After I passed into this world? W: Yes. OL: The
realization that my mind still was the same as it was before my
transition, this was for me the greatest enlightment. I had of course
many contacts to the spirit world before, but I could not really imagine
that I will be just the same Oliver Lodge as before - that I will pass
over with the same mind structure. This was the most
important learning as well as the fact that it is especially important
to open yourselves during lifetime as much as possible to spiritual
matters, since it means an enormous help to get acquainted to spirit
world after the transition. If you have worked on your spiritual
advancement before it is much easier to “get aboard”. This was as well
one of the most important perceptions. W: … and that you were not instantly
refined. OL: Yes, it is not like that. I hope we
will be able to converse together more often, and also the friends over
here did listen to our conversation. We will try to introduce our group
here. W: Well. E: I have a last question, Sir Oliver.
Are you aware of the name Burkhard Heim? OL: Yes. W: ... and do you know his theories? OL: Yes, we did already meet. E: Thank you. OL: Very interesting exchange of
thoughts, similar structure. E: Yes. OL: I think, my friends, for now I hand
you over to Claudius again, but let`s have a short break before. W: Many thanks. OL: It was very
pleasant to talk to you. Walter, should you one day get into contact
with my friend Raymond Smith and his wife June, then please pass on to
them my best wishes. E/W: Yes, Thank
you. OL: Thank you for
your listening to me. I say good bye. 2nd
Conversation: Ectoplasm and other Physical Phenomena.
W: Perhaps you
can tell us your present view on the ectoplasm phenomena. OL: They are
handled very controversially. On one hand side we appreciate that there
are mediums that work with ectoplasm, on the other hand side it would be
more sensible if you could work without the danger for the mediums. But
the time is not yet quite ripe for it. There are however
phenomena that work without ectoplasm and which are not only depending
on the medium alone, which can be directed without having the medium
stressed too much by the ectoplasm's emergence. Ectoplasm is -
you discussed that before - a special form of spirit matter, because
there is no better term for it. As Ernst said, in
principal everything is retrievable out of the morphic field or
information field.
This substance is provided by the medium so that a spirit person can
manifest. This would not be possible this way otherwise. The medium’s
substance is necessary to build a body, to afterwards vanish back into
the medium’s body, where it is not detectable.
Possible apparitions without ectoplasm would only be a shadow of what
happens here. So, an ectoplasm manifestation is something different
compared to a ghost apparition, an apparition that is not controlled by
a real personality. In the case of an ectoplasm apparition the being
that has lived , exists again in its original form, which certainly
appears to you like a miracle.
W: Yes, probably for you back then as well. OL: Certainly. It
still is for us something that we cannot explain one hundred percent. It
happens without being able to describe every step sufficiently. From our side you
of course can lead and support a medium, but you never know what is
going on in the medium in that moment. It is an automatism that then
becomes effective if the constellation is right. The phenomena are
not retrievable according to a certain plan at all times of the day. It
even might happen that if the constellation is all right out of any
reason the phenomenon is blocked, so that we never have full control
over the occurrence.
W: The phenomenon is extremely convincing. And I am always curious if it
would not be possible to come forward without the darkness with
respective technical devices. I think of thermal imaging cameras which
are actually a passive system that do not send out something. It is
always pointed out from spirit side that this is not acceptable.
OL: These are precautions. Maybe it would work with technical devices,
if you could get away from your fear of everything that could happen,
the fear of all things that could happen and partially have happened in
the past. The fear can cause what potentially can happen.
W: Therefore phenomena can be blocked? OL: Phenomena can
be blocked. The fear can possibly have the effect that something happens
in connection with new methods. If the experimenters could be totally
open and relaxed about new methods it probably would work, this has
happened already. Fear in connection with new methods also can provide
ground for failures. If a medium always is told that it is in danger the
fear is always present. And if really something unpleasant happens fear
can be one part of triggering it
off. You often attract danger with your fear.
E: Yes, perhaps the fear according to past experience, and as you said
and also due these there has been built up a certain field of fear, ... OL: Certainly.
E: ... and to destroy this it needs some courage. OL: Yes, that’s
right, in the past there were insufficient precautions in regard to the
audience. There were no controls and regulations. Everybody just could
walk in or out, and there are always people who deliberately like to
disturb and to harm the medium. And of course it
is possible to harm a medium while in trance producing ectoplasm
something that would not be possible with the medium in this room,
because it is not in full trance, although in an altered state of
consciousness. A medium totally in deep trance cannot react to
disturbances quickly enough, and then that might affect the mind quite
dramatically. This fact groups did not take into consideration properly
in former times, of course, out of financial reasons as well. The more
visitors the more the cash box was filled. W: I have two
more questions, one concerning the voice box and the other one
concerning the mechanics. I
start with the mechanics. The ectoplasm phenomenon ought to create quite
strong forces and actually also reaction forces (when for example the
trumpet quickly changes direction), if I just compare it with our
mechanics. I do not know how the forces are transferred or are our
normal physical laws in that moment, as
we know them in our mechanics like action and reaction
or force and counterforce or
torques etc., are they not applicable?
OL: It is switched off. It is a process that - let’s say - certainly
would be possible without ectoplasm, since you probably heard already of
levitations without ectoplasm.
W: Yes, we had that in Scole.
OL: In case it is worked with ectoplasm you cannot think in your
physical laws. It is then our part as well to accomplish that. And the
trumpets moving around in the room for example is something to - I do
not want to say to amuse you - ... W: ... to impress.
OL: … to impress you. It is similar to the effect as it was with the
little lights in Scole, only that these were not bound to ectoplasm as
the trumpets were.
E: I think there are, as we discussed during the last sitting, distinct
hints about fields which do actually change the basic structure - we
call them vacuum or so - metrologically proven, so that physical laws do
not apply anymore. In this manner everything which is included in our
laws of nature is being overpowered or shut off, and there exists
primarily a psychic field which obviously changes space and with space
the physical laws as well. OL: Right. It
even can happen that you see something, somebody else does not see
subjectively, because he is not able to see it, or perhaps he is not
willing to see it. You might be open minded and therefore you see it.
Everybody approaches things from a different point of view to observe
things and he will afterwards describe his observation according to his
perception. For somebody who is questioning things constantly, for him
there might be no lightened trumpets moving around in the room. Everybody senses
these phenomena differently. Also your skill for illusion is involved. A
person without any imagination will not capture the phenomena as such. A
person that is able to imagine that there is a subject in the air which
is directed by a beam of ectoplasm - even if he does not see it actually -
for him the phenomenon is real. Another person might not be able to
adopt to this idea and he will not internalise the phenomenon in this
way.
It is a subjective matter, although the phenomenon is perhaps perceived
by some like-minded people in the room that view it as objective
happening at the same time.
E: It is the transition from a subjective experience by an individual
person into a collective experience which we then indicate as objective. OL: For a strong
critic there would be no trumpets move around within the room the way
they do. W: Is this only
in his perception, or does he influence the phenomenon? OL: To begin with
it is his perception, but he in the second step can also manipulate or
prevent the phenomenon. If his thought field is strong enough to
influence others he might be able to manipulate them and this might even
initiate a breakup of the phenomenon. In case of a breakup a switch on
of light would be for example could result in a possible harming of the
medium without being able to proof that the disturbance as described
before was the real cause. E: It looks like
- unfortunately it is not seen or it is not taken into consideration
sufficiently, not even by people who have experienced this for years in
spiritual and parapsychological circles - that the influences of
negative minded critics can suppress phenomena that are normally very
reasonable. OL: Yes, suppress. E: This means
that on the other hand side this world in which we believe to live as
material beings is much more rooted in our psyche than we normally
accept. OL: If this
critic sits amongst a group sending out negative thoughts, it might be
that these people will not notice this, but will unconsciously be
affected, because of the critic’s strong presence.
According to your terms there are people that have a negative or
positive presence. Even if a person shows a friendly face he or she can
inwardly have a totally negative attitude. This is not being registered
by other people in the same room knowingly, but is taken on board
unconsciously. So that the whole room might suddenly be charged with a
rather not positive flair, which then influences also the others in the
room so that all in the room are affected by
E: Well, this is understandable. W: Whereas I try
to be fair in so far that the critics often have exposed those that have
cheated. OL: Walter, this
is not unusual in life, everywhere is being cheated, and if you
constantly would chase people that are cheating on others, then you
would have a full time job.
If a medium commits fraud, it might be that he or she will have
superficially an advantage, but at the end it comes back to that person.
People that are cheating often attract people that cheat on them as
well, they want to be cheated on. This is a fact.
There are too many gullible people. You yourselves have to find out in
which company of people you get into, and you will, if your watch out
carefully, get a feeling for it. There are people that are however eager
to get cheated on.
W: Now my question to the voice box. To get an idea mechanically, I have
the picture that principally with ectoplasm vocal cords are being
recreated to produce actually speech within the room, even music,
possible.
OL: You as well know about voices within the room without ectoplasm.
W/E: Yes.
OL: So that this is a mixture.
W: The point I am focusing on is, our ears function or react quasi to
these sound waves. That means a sound wave needs to be created. Do I
have to create this in that way that I reproduce something to send an
air stream through it - as it is common in the mechanic system - or does
it work also differently? OL: It also works
differently. It is like that: we give impulses in form of thoughts that
are translated into language. This is a difficult task. I suppose you
have discussed this before that a kind of “help plane” is involved which
- to just give a picture - translates our impulses, so that our thought
forms can be heard with your ears. This has nothing
to do with any mechanical helping device, also it is not necessarily
ectoplasm involved. We have, as you know, in Scole brought voices
through a defective device to you. Here no ectoplasm was involved. This
to explain is quite difficult, but it is possible to achieve this
without mechanic intervention.
W: The conclusion is that if something reaches my ear drum, a sonic
vibration, then it should theoretically come from somewhere being
created at some spot. This mechanism is not clear to me. If in the
centre of an empty room a vibration, an impulse emanates, has this
something to do with materialisation/dematerialisation?
OL: The voice is quasi materialised, impulses are brought into verbal
form. It is
always materialized. Spirit matter is being made audible in
contradiction to something tangible like a person or an object. It is in
both cases the same basic substance, both are quasi materialisations.
W: You only needed a thought.
OL: Yes, it is not only the voice, there are other noises like raps and
taps involved, all this is being materialised.
E: Yes, this is interesting, because Manfred Boden (a deceased
paranormal researcher who had spirit telephone contacts) who heard
voices via telephone while talking to a friend on the other end of the
line. These voices were only heard by him and not by the person he had
this telephone conversation with. He then asked the entities that
intruded into the telephone line how they would do this. The answer was:
“These are impulses that are only heard by a medium”.
OL: Yes, the interesting thing is if in a room with 50 people everybody
can hear the voice then they are not necessarily all mediums. Although
in this moment a special psychic field is established. E: Yes.
OL: I would not exclude that a strong sceptic claims he does not hear
the voice, because he is not willing to. I have talked about this
before. Mostly of course people that attend such an event are normally
in line with the procedures and contribute with a certain attitude so
that everything is possible and the phenomena are working out without
disturbance. In this case you could say at this moment in this room are
sitting “mediums”, the way you probably meant it.
E: Yes, this is only one side, because you can record for example Leslie
Flint´s voices via a normal microphone, and in this sense they are quite
objective. This is again the problem where does subjectivity and the
objectivity begin and how is it possible to differentiate.
OL: If they are generally audible then they are in your terms objective.
If they are only heard by one person as in the case of the telephone
conversation then they exist, but are only subjectively perceivable,
because they are possibly only meant for this person or that the other
person at the end of the line is totally blocked.
E: This can be true, since also in the case of Manfred Boden the voices
are recorded. They objectively exist, or you would have to assume that
he projected the voices onto the technical device with his psyche
himself. OL: If he had
this ability then it would represent the way we work. Also you are in
principle spirit, spirit entities in physical bodies. And why should you
not have abilities like we do have them!? Of course it is
easier for us, because we can act independent from earthly physical
laws. We are weightless. If I may say so, you are bound to your physical
body that certainly is a handicap. But it is
possible that humans are able to produce phenomena that are similar to
ours. E: And this seems
to be similar in the audible, in the optical section. OL: Yes, humans
are capable of many things and in the moment you discard your
barricades, partially unconsciously, these phenomena happen. You are
once in a while free entities, free from earthly ballast, something once
you are afterwards in full consciousness you cannot reconstruct anymore.
E: Yes, but this means if we - as Walter does as an engineer - try to
reconstruct in reducing these things in our system to certain sequences
or details that the question is being asked wrongly.
OL: The speech you hear within the room seems for you to come from a
person and that the words that reach you are spoken in a sequence. But
they are not sent out by us this way. It is one impulse that includes
everything, ...
W: Yes. OL: … but you
cannot perceive it in this form. You can do that only in your dreams. In
your memory everything is recorded as sequence, but within the dream
itself it is all extremely condensed, similar to our impulses that reach
you as a sequence of words. E: Yes, yes,
whereas once Adolf Homes (deceased EVP researcher) received a message -
which in this connection might be interesting -. It was said that this
one impulse spirit partners send is being absorbed by us differently
depending on the kind of our technical receiver unit, so that the
message can have different effects. OL: Right.
E: And the differentiation is created by our sensory organs. It takes
apart - hearing and seeing - what is actually a conglomerate of a
coherent structure.
OL: Yes, it is one impulse which includes everything, and you then
select in hearing, seeing and feeling.
W: Then this also applies to the film work in Scole - that the whole
peom was imprinted with one impulse. OL: Yes, we do
not work in sequences. It is certainly very hard for you to
understand and for us difficult to bring over to you something that you
cannot imagine. W: Not to be able
to understand, this is the difficulty for us. OL: You could say
a drop of water includes the information of the whole universe.
How shall a human
being be able to imagine that?
W: That we heard before, but in connection with a grain of sand.
OL: Grain of sand or drop of water,
both are only pictorial aids.
W: Have you been aware what happened to David Thompson during the
séance? At the end he - sitting on his chair - was placed in a distance
of 1.5 m away from his original location. Could you please comment this?
OL: It is not a carrying through the room, it is a materialisation. Here
it is worked for our understanding with simple means, because it is
easier for us to dematerialise and materialise instantly than to conduct
a transport from one spot to another within a room.
W: We have talked about the vest that was taken off the medium while he
was bound to the chair. Now I read lately that somebody found a piano
floating over his head, something very impressing.
E: It is an old discussion that somebody (probably Greek origin) once
said: What we declare as a continous path is actually an instantly
vanishing and a reappearance in a short distance. That means our
perception is a chain of impulses.
If you view this from a different point it seems at least that there is
the impression that the universe exists in such impulses. This would
mean that we live half time in our world and half time in yours. OL: You could
describe it like that, yes. W: Could you join
us in this view? OL: Let’s say, to
give you an impression, yes, but we see it totally different. (amusement on both sides)
W: This answer is what I have feared for.
OL: For us there is no progressive ...
E: ... progressive path movement, yes.
OL: But, let’s say, to approach a bit more from your sight, it is not a
bad picture if you have an imagination. There are people who are not
able to have any imagination. Total materialists cannot accept that
picture, because they fear that this world then would not be a hundred
percent built materially. For us this world in which you live is built
up totally different. This thought humans are afraid of, since they
cling onto matter totally.
With you in this room it is somehow different. You already search for
the way out of this material world. But if this material environment
brings you some kind of luxury and beauty, a good life, then you on the
other hand side are not too much reluctant. W: Right, yes.
OL: But, let’s say, you try however to question all that, and this is
already - I don’t want to say praiseworthy - but remarkable for your
advancement.
E: Ernst describes our perception of something that appears to us in a
sequence in single pictures, but actually every picture is included in
one picture instantly, but not perceived by us this way.
OL: Yes, that is right, as explanation when you use - let’s say - a
term.
The concept water for example includes all that has to do with water,
each drop of water, the ocean, the water you drink. All this
simultaneously exists. If you concentrate on a chair then you see the
piece of wood, how it is cut off the tree, etc. And if you could manage
to bring together all these single steps in one thought then this would
come near to how we perceive this. E: Yes.
OL: And this applies to everything.
E: Yes of course, and we see the outsides, we see neither the procedure
that has lead to something, nor do we see the world inside. OL: This applies
to every concept, also to a concept that is not tangible. If you take
the concept “Beauty”, then you can touch something that is beautiful,
but the term “Beauty” as such contains at the same time an enormous
amount of details representing this concept. You use as human - if you
describe “Beauty” – in succession several sentences and yet you do not
strike the whole content. For us “Beauty” is a comprehensive concept
instantly available in one impulse, describing everything that is
involved in beauty. 3. Various
Questions addressed to Oliver during a group sitting.
Cl: My dear
friends, I will pass on to you Oliver. OL: Hello, ... W/E: Hello,
Oliver.
OL: Walter, Ernst, etc. - all German names, wondrous that I memorize
them, but I am already acquainted to, so that we can speak in German.
It is again a pleasure for me to be with you, and if you have questions
concerning Scole I am very much willing to answer them. But feel free to
answer other questions as well.
W: I start with a question and will then pass on to the others.
OL: You can ask, if you want, about totally different matters, let’s
say, in connection with the human structure. W: If you stand for something you believe in, then this is nowadays as it was at your time, and I especially refer to your situation in your time which was probably not totally uncritical. I count you to these people that have gone quite far. You have brought in your reputation to convince others that there is a live after death. This I find admirable. OL: Walter, only
to be sentenced to the stake would have detained me. Thank goodness - I
did not live in these days. And also Kopernikus (Polish/German
Astronomer 1473 - 1543) was lucky, because it could have happened to him
as well, to others it did, as you know. I’m not sure if I
would have set up my theses
in
medieval
times or if I would have
approached the public with them, if I would have gone that far as I did
in my times. I was able to,
because nobody would have contradicted. You cannot recommend somebody
for the Nobel Prize and at the same time declare him as insane. Then the
scientists would have had to come to an agreement. I anyway did not
care, I was not afraid that my reputation would get ruined, since I had
quite a number of like-minded people who perhaps did not step forward
too much in public, but would have supported me, renowned personalities,
so the danger was not too big.
You are quite right; it needs some courage to publish these statements
in writing. But, as I said, the time was not too dangerous for that
anymore. It was rather dangerous for mediums, as you know, because
possible damages to mediums were not excluded, but not to a scientist
like me.
W: Nowadays almost nobody is willing to prove these phenomena anymore,
and this is something you did. You did have the basis and facts for
that, which were not easy to be disproved by others. But in our time
almost nobody has got the courage anymore to risk their title or
position in society. OL: Yes,
especially on the European continent, since it is more difficult over
there to defend these phenomena as it is in our small Kingdom, on the
British Islands. You will realise that over there quite some interesting and known people - let’s say - are engaged with these topics and bring them near to the public, more than this happens on the continent. The continental public is more sceptical, as it is in England. In England it can happen that you neighbour declares you as mad, but this doesn’t matter, he is used to cope with these types. Englishmen do not see themselves as so much important as individual person. Do you understand what I mean?
W: Yes, I think so.
OL: There are some social classes that superficially want to distance
themselves from these matters, but nevertheless just these social
classes are connected quite obviously with them. You only need to start
with the Royals. Here healers go in and out, here mediums go in and out.
This is the reason why it is easier to admit your involvement in
spiritual matters, and this was always like that.
W: Yes, that makes sense. RE: It depends
also on the consciousness of the person that receives the information.
And in our society it is the case that everybody is overfed with other
activities that they do not want or can bother with these things. OL: Yes. But it
is also the case that on the continent out of everything is taken an
advantage. This is something that happens in England too, but it is not
yet established so strongly. On the continent the whole matter is seen
commercially as the esoteric fairs clearly show. And this is
unfortunately ruinously for the substance, for the true substance which
cannot penetrate, because it is overshadowed by these negative events
and the exaggerated commercial attitudes. And this is a major difference
to a country, a traditional spiritual country like England. RE: A thesis
which I personally find applicable says: Things get the importance that
is given them. OL: Correct.
RE: I have got myself a pentagram, ...
OL: Yes.
RE: ...but I also have bought a hexagram. Well, there a people who
accuse the pentagram of a “negative” meaning, if the peak stands upside
down. It the peak points upwards then it would be “positive” energized. OL: Well, if you
hand over the penta- or hexagram to a Kalahari inhabitant, he might turn
it around in any direction; for him it will be neither “positive” nor
“negative”, because he does not attach importance to this object. RE: Why do you
just mention the Kalahari inhabitant, this is my favourite example?! OL: Well, you
also could change it into Eskimo. (amusement) RE: Therefore it
has no meaning. OL: It is the
same if some people assign a stone, let’s say a crystal, with some
meaning, for example a mountain crystal or an amethyst or a rose quartz.
If you use this stone with the sureness or with the wish to give healing
to somebody then it will probably function. And now again to
the example with the Kalahari inhabitant who has no quartz on hand; he
will take a normal stone he finds in the desert or a peace of wood, and
with the same intent it will have the same result. RE: That means
every pebble stone can heal. OL: So it is. E: Yes, and he of
course will have different objects that are for him more important in
this connection. OL: So it is,
yes. E: This of course
relativises many aspects in the so called esoteric. OL: Right.
E: I remember in the phase of my first EVP recordings that I left the
house. While away the device was running, and after a quarter of an hour
the following sentence was well to be understood: “For whom is this
mission important?” This is actually exactly that we interpret the
objects or the stream, the dynamic from our side very personally or in
groups.
OL: Yes.
RE: This again means consciousness. What does influence our
consciousness mostly, our thinking, I assume. The thinking influences
the consciousness, I think, because I have to train my consciousness.
OL: You have to differentiate, how do you understand consciousness? RE: Aha.
OL: Thinking is not doing it alone.
RE: Yes, true.
OL: It is the quality of your thought.
RE: And the acceptance. OL: Yes. There
are great thinkers that are not more advanced in their consciousness as
somebody who works on the field from morning to evening to earn his
every day’s bread and doesn’t have time for thinking. And this applies
also to somebody who has every possibility financially to buy himself
books etc. He must not necessarily be more advanced in his consciousness
as somebody who has no means and only is busy working to satisfy his
family’s basic needs. Nevertheless he might be a person that will arrive
in spirit world with quite an advanced consciousness, because he managed
his meagre existence with bravery.
RE: That means consciousness always refers to special parts of our
being, of our life. There is for example a spiritual consciousness and a
body consciousness and probably a lot more forms of consciousness, and
all together determine a human. OL: Right. Let’s say a mentally disabled person has got generally a different consciousness. Nevertheless he can - even he never was able to exchange thoughts about spirituality - get into spirit world with a far more advanced consciousness as somebody who was concentrating on that subject his whole life.
HE: Does it mean, it is important to live my life according to the
slogan: Don’t do anything
to somebody else what you do not want he does to you? OL: Yes, there is
this one commandment that includes all others, if you consider your ten
commandments. You only have to obey this one. But, as you know,
you are not judged by anybody else over here after your transition. You
yourselves evaluate your life, and then you will find out what you have
neglected to do and what you could have done. But everything is
not that tragical, humans cannot be perfect. You live in a world with
millions of influences that affect you, and your assignment is to learn
out of the situation. So it would be senseless to put a perfect human in
an imperfect world like yours, because he then would not have the
opportunity to learn, unless he would deliberately choose a live in
perfectness. But this is not realistic. Even Jesus was a human with
human weaknesses. 4. Exchange of
thoughts with Claudius and friends about Oliver Lodge
In the following
chapter we recite small fractions of conversations with our spirit
friends about Oliver Lodge. Walter is posing
the question about the whole creation. Cl: There is
neither a beginning nor an end, as you know.
One world permeates the other. One sphere penetrates the other.
Everything happens in this moment right here.
W: In this connection Oliver Lodge talked about an all-pervasive ether.
Is this only a mental theoretical aid for us, or is it something what
makes sense to you as well?
Cl: He was already during lifetime very much interested in these things
and researched in this respect. I can generally speaking agree to that.
There are various terms for this ether, but principally it should be
found a terminology that is understood by everybody, and I can get
friendly with this one.
As human you cannot capture it, even for some spirits it is not easy to
imagine something all-pervasive.
W: Could you replace the term ether by information field?
Cl: It is, you could say, placed above the information field.
Nevertheless you should not imagine a borderline. As we always say, it
is floating.
W: We always think of a local limit, although it is not like that.
Cl: Imagine the ocean. On top you have the warmer layers of water
pervaded by the sun. Here you have not any boarder lines either. Once in
a while the warmer layers emerge into the colder parts underneath to
return back again into their warmer realms above. This is a similar
picture.
W: This is a nice picture.
CL: Also a fish that normally swims in the layers above will once in a
while dive into the deeper layers and will return back. It will not feel
comfortable in the deeper layers of water, therefore he automatically
will return to the realms where he feels well, into the layer above.
W: Is there a possibility for us to understand ether?
Cl: You always have the imagination of a substance.
W: Yes, this is the problem. Cl: It is not a
substance. If at all, you could talk about a spiritual substance. W: For us neither
tangible nor traceable. Cl: In no way
traceable. W: Therefore with
our physics not detectable. Cl: Yes. W: Many people
tried to prove ether. Cl: People mix up
ether with the so called ectoplasm. Both at first sight have nothing to
do with each other, because ectoplasm is visible and physically
tangible. This as well is not easy for you to comprehend. The act of an
ectoplasm emission is being controlled spiritually. It is for you a
visible part of spirit matter. Cl: Depending
from where, from which level, from which sphere you observe the cosmos
it will appear differently. Researchers like
Oliver who arrive here with the knowledge of physical matters,
especially the cosmos, the universe will at first follow up these topics
over here as well as they did on earth, because for us the cosmos does
not exist the way it does for you. The cosmos over here exists only if
you want to have it. A level higher -
this is no judging - a step further into a higher consciousness level,
he will handle this topic differently as at the beginning. He does not
handle it anymore like he did on earth, he will see everything in a
whole simultaneous happening. And in this consciousness level you do not
need anymore earthly numerical calculations to figure out the cosmos. There is nothing
to calculate, because everything is present at the same time. In a unity
everything is included, even the one who is calculating, so there are no
calculations necessary anymore. This is the view when you arrive on that consciousness level where you perceive everything simultaneously. And it is not important anymore if there was or was not a big bang. This is an imagination created by humans.
W: The book “Raymond“ by Oliver Lodge gives good insights and confirms
many facts, it also contains additional and supplementary descriptions I
never thought of before. I like it very much, because it also takes off
the grief. Other books by him go into this direction as well, and I am
sure we will have further questions in this connection. Cl: Yes, these
books are authentical. Books that are published nowadays are a
collection of the contents of many other books, but Oliver’s books are
authentical, because everything was experienced by himself, he did not
leave anything out and did not add something that has not happened. This book
“Raymond” of course helped many people at that time, but actually it can
only help of course if people find an entry into this topic. Cl: Yes, as Karin
said this afternoon, Oliver’s book that was written at the beginning of
last century contains similar explanations in regard to thoughts about
the human being, similar to what we have already discussed with you
years ago. Actually the book contains exactly what we have discussed
with you. AE: (Albert
Einstein) We often have discussions over here, because Oliver for
example lived a different life stile in comparison to mine, but he
quickly learned - like I did too - that all this is not relevant
anymore, it does not count over here anymore if you had titles like
“Sir” or doctor or professor, what ever. In your case, when you come
over to us, you will be just Walter Schnittger, all your titles acquired
by studies and in your profession have no meaning anymore. Titles will not
be valued anymore if you are together with like-minded spirits that are
consciously advanced. They will be only valued on a level where spirits
are still clinch to this earthly hierarchy thinking. In our spheres
there is some hierarchy as well, but in a totally different sense, it is
a spiritual hierarchy order. And this is exactly what Oliver quickly recognised. Therefore we had and have discussions, we also come together with like-minded spirits, because we discarded these earthly privileges and still do approach each other with greatest respect. Also Nikola (Tesla) had great difficulties, the greatest of us all. He at first hesitated to accept this law. About my case -
we perhaps talk at another time -, and perhaps also Oliver would like to
participate in such a discussion, since he at the time of his transition
was already very much acquainted with spiritual matters and had a basic
spiritual background. Our discussions over here are very interesting,
since we both see things partly differently. Oliver was very much into
the ether theories during lifetime, something I was not that much
interested in, but now we find a consensus quite easily. We - as well as
you on earth - should be honest with each other. Exaggerated adulations
do not bring anybody forward in their life, because everybody has got
his own qualities. Not only Albert Einstein, Oliver Lodge or Nikola
Teasla have “eaten the wisdom with a spoon” (German expression “Die
Weisheit mit dem Löffel gegessen”). There were many things I could not
accomplish during my lifetime; others perhaps were maybe better in doing
them, things potentially achieved more for the individuum, but this is
difficult to judge. NT: (Nikola
Tesla) The composition we have at the moment over here is that several
spirits are in our round, and perhaps one or more will join us. That we,
Oliver, Albert and myself work together with you again was triggered off
by you mainly, because we feel familiar with you, I because of our
sittings many years ago with the medium Franz (deceased German medium),
Oliver and Albert of course with you in Scole. Cl: Although we
are here together in harmony, it is important that for example Nikola
Tesla presents himself to you in his individual form, different to,
let’s say, Albert Einstein or Oliver Lodge. All spirits have their
peculiarities, although we are in agreement about these spiritual
topics. But also here there are different interpretations according to
the structure of the individual spirit. It is of major importance that
the individuality comes through. Otherwise it would be boring for you -
for us as well -. W: Perhaps you can confirm this, I’m
pretty sure you are in contact with Oliver. Helen Duncan: Of
course Oliver Lodge was at his time very helpful, although I did not
have great contact. It was for other mediums, he was very helpful, yes. AE: (Albert
Einstein) For example, I never had the courage to present my “spiritual
knowledge” to the public, as our friend Oliver Lodge did. Although I was
known as a, let’s say, “somehow slightly crazy type”, I did not dare to
state things like Oliver did. Montague Keen:
... and I very often think about you. I do not want to go into any
details, I just want to let you know, it is all fine over here, and our
work is excellent. I’m over here together with some of my colleagues.
Some of them I did not know in lifetime, for instance Oliver Lodge, whom
I now call a colleague. I just want to say hello, I also pass on to you
greetings from Oliver and from all the friends over here, and perhaps we
get the opportunity to talk together in the new year.
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